SurClaro Flight Simulator Resources

MrJoe33 · Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Posts: 4

I am flyning an 747-400 in thick fog..any tips on how to land when you cant see anything....any of the buttons do anything to make it easy beside GPS??????? Thanks.

danberndtson · Joined: 01 Apr 2003 Posts: 2 Location: Hull, England

hi mrjoe33

You can tune into the NDB (non directional beacon) for the air port your flying to if it has one or you can tune in to NAV1 with the frequency for the ILS Approach for that particular run way, both these should help get you home safely

MrJoe33 · Joined: 23 Apr 2003 Posts: 4

Cool...thanks. :P

bigphatmatt · Joined: 29 Aug 2003 Posts: 4

The obvious thing to do would be an ILS approach, but they're not always very acurate in flight sim :roll:

try it anyway, it works most of the time,

Matt

cruas · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 11

There are some things you may need to know in order to perform more real IFR Landings.

The 747 is not equipped with a GPS in real life, so try not use it.
On the other hand when you perform this kind of approaches you have to trust ATC, in real life that will be the only way to find the airport and the runway. Also in real life IFR approaches will be performed using the ILS (depending on the airport a VOR may be used but is totally a different procedure and you may need the approach chart for the airport).

What we try to do in real life when the visibility conditions are not proper for a visual approach is to use the autoland feature but it is turned off before you land in order to land manually. By using the AP it will be easier to get aligned with the runway and prepare for the touch down. Also in real life you may not land when the visibility is very bad (ATC will close the operations for that airport and transfer you to another one in order to land safely), of course landing with the conditions you mentioned is a must in simulations in order to trust your instruments.

It requires a lot of hours to be able to perform them, additionally there is a lot of information about the aircraft you need to know (by memory) in order to land safely.

If you have further questions or want to have real information about it you may write me to carloruas@hotmail.com.

Bye!
Carlo Ruas

simon_lwc · Joined: 28 Jul 2004 Posts: 1

Carlo Ruas,

Are you a real "747-400 PILOT"?

From the way you are talking, you know a lot of real Pilot action. :D

Simon

Cobra Driver · Joined: 08 Jul 2004 Posts: 67 Location: Rucker

The ILS approach is the way to go. Usually gets you to 200 feet AGL, some are 250.

Make sure, once on final, the aircraft is stabilized and dirty (all flaps and gear down upon interecepting glide slope). Try to maintain a 400 foot per minute rate of descent and don't touch power, simply adjust attitude, pitch up or down with attitude to maintain glide path.

That's a simplified explanation.

Main thing is practice, practice, practice

Cobra Driver

Rhythmosaur · Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2004 7:23 am Post subject:

Hi Carlo,

You said, in real life, the ATC is the only way to find the runway for the 747 is not equiped with a GPS.

When I was flying along with the Eurowings fleet in FS02 days, I had to study the functionality of the FMCU (Flight Manmagement Computer Unit)they offered with the A319 and, reduced for lateral navigation, with the BAE 146 and ATRs 42 and 72. I also enjoyed and used the FMCU coming with the PSS A319/A320/A321 add on (it was easier to use, but had more functions though).

In the Eurowings Manual, they were saying, this FMCU was an adapted one they took from another Boeing 747 add on. My question now:

Does the 747 have a FMCU in real life, and if, why does it not help (if I understand you the right way) with ILS landings?

Thank you in advance,

The Rhythmosaur

cruas · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 11

Hi Johannes,

As I've noticed you're familiar with FMC procedures. But for all the people that aren't, here is a small introduction:

FMC (Flight Management Computer)

The FMC is an old technology system, it has evolved but it's esence remains. Before the GPS (Ground Positioning System) the IRS (Inertial Reference System) was the only tool to fly to a certain destination without the use of any navaids. The IRS uses true north as a reference and it is needed to tell the system the coordinates for the origin position. Some planes (Shorts) used this kind of technology on systems very close to VOR or ADF Instruments. When it was needed to fly under IRS Instruments, the origin and destination coordinates were needed before pullback (or at least takeoff). FMC technology is based on IRS.

The FMC is basically a computer able to manage a complete fligt. The FMC includes information regarding aircraft data, airport information, airways information, coordinates, frequencies for COM, VOR, NDB and ILS as well as fixes, SIDs and STARs.

The information form the flight is entered during the "preparation". Origin (Airport, Takeoff Runway), Flight Number, Destination, Fuel, Flight Level, Ascent Rate and Type (Example: VSI 1250/Economy), Speed during "climb", Cruise Speed, Descent... Information regarding the flying LEGS, alternate airport, fuel for alternate airport, destination runways, wind corrections, SIDs and STARs for destination and alternative airport is also introduced.

All this information is transferred to the plane control during the flight between the FMC, IRS, EHSI, EADI, AFDS and the autopilot. In order to help more the FMC is programmed to tune COM, VOR or ILS.

IRS - Inertial Reference System
EHSI - Electronic Horizontal Situation Alert System
EADI - Electronic Attitude Direction Indicator
AFDS - Automatic Flight Director System
VOR - VHF Omnidirectional Range Station
ILS - Instrument Landing System

All this information is able to handle an autoland. On planes like the 747 autoland is a must when the wheater conditions are for ILS Landings. Regulations on many countries do not allow pilots to perform complete autolands, the AP should be turned off once the plane has reached the decision point (usually NDB marker Inner "Blue Light" and sound alert). From this point the plane should be landed manually, of course it may be easy from there on...

Even if the FMC is able to perform the whole flight (including landing) it needs a human brain (at least to program it). In case of emergencies the FMC will not be the best option, and even with bad weather conditions if you have to land a 747 with only one engine it has to be performend manually.

The FMC is a tool and will never be equal to human experience. On the other hand communications between ATC and the pilots is very critical when you enter crowded skies and airports. A lof of coordination is needed to enter into sequence landing paths, the FMC will be used (for example for a HOLD path, it´s better letting the computer do the boring circle path).

The combination between Pilot, ATC, FMC, Instruments, Navaids and a very reliable crew is the only way to mantain security on very high standars. Remember, is your life after all!

On a 747 there is no time to hesitate (too much weight, to much speed, too much belly). I love flying, but I love living too!

I may trust my instruments and instincts, but I trust my crew too and when you are flying ATC (IFR) is part of my crew.

Thanks for the interest!

cruas · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Posts: 11

By the way...

The 747 is equipped with two FMC... Pilot and Copilot!

Rhythmosaur · Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2004 2:52 pm Post subject:

Thank you very much. I think this is way more helpful than we could expect.

The Rhythmosaur

andyaude · Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 19 Location: United States

cruas wrote: By the way...

The 747 is equipped with two FMC... Pilot and Copilot! WRONG there's actually 3. one in the middle behind the throttles, usually used for acars, but its still a mcdu.

paulvil · Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:17 pm Post subject:

You realise that the last post here was over a year ago and that these people most likely don't come here any more... right?