FS9 vs. FSX helicopter flying - FS9 is hardly a sim here...

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mangaroca
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FS9 vs. FSX helicopter flying - FS9 is hardly a sim here...

Post by mangaroca » Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:21 pm

Hi,

I have just returned to FS9 from FSX (my PC is still too weak to run it smooth enough). I bought Alphasim's fantastic AH-64D Longbow Apache and flew it in FSX for a couple of weeks. However, I grew tired of empty landscapes my PC was displaying for me on Mid-Low detail settings...

When I installed and launched the AH-64D on FS9 I was shocked how this game simulates helicopters! I simply got used to the precise and responsive steering offered by FSX... I play on max realism so I am aware of all the phisical and aerodynamical aspects of helo flying but the things that are happening in FS9 are just too much for me... The flight model is unrealistic! The Apache swings from left to right (rudder) and takes ages to react to the joystick inputs! I tried to increase the sensivities but maxing them only worsened the flying experience...
I thought that maybe it's the AH-64D's air/cfg files that are written wrong and jumped into Bell 212. Same there!!!

Now, I've seen videos of massive multi-player helo takeoffs on youtube.com that were so well coordinated and synhronised that they simply took my breath away... Does this mean the pilots were on EASY realism settings??? I mean, I can fly helos and no way I'd be able to perform what they had shown there with the way FS9 treats my rotorcraft...

Either way, I just wanted to ask if anyone had similar experience. Perhaps something can be done with the "swinging" and response times...? Please, tell me what you think...

Regards -
Darek G.

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Post by harkonnen » Thu Dec 04, 2008 6:14 pm

Hiya. It has been noted (lamented) that FSX got it right regarding helo flying and FS9....uh, NOT SO MUCH!

Do you have an aversion to dropping the helo realism settings in FS9? In my opinion and experience, arcade physics in FS are no fun really, but is there a mid-point with realism settings that may allow you to enjoy your favourite chopper without feeling like an 8-year-old?

Also, personal experience reveals that persistent practice with the lousy FS9 helo dynamics helps a little. You just get used to overcompensating and not overcompensating, if that makes any sense.

Maybe more playing around in the sensitivities section is in order to try and level the playing field a bit.

What about checking out 'Hovercontrol', and 'The LZ', two sites dedicated to flying helicopters within FS...they may have actual concise answers for ya, where I tend to surmise and ramble, LOL. :mrgreen:

In regards to the 'swinging' in FS9...I find that with persistence and a few minutes of adjustment and fine tuning the stick movements, the Robinson Trainer, at least, does settle down a little. She evens out not too badly and you can concentrate on the slight rudder-offset position to counter-react the over-rotation tendencies. Ramble ramble. :D

We have some accomplished flyers around here, hopefully some more input will be forthcoming.
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Post by capt.PropwashKCHS » Fri Dec 05, 2008 2:50 am

i love helo flying in FS9. EC145, Bell 206, Bell Huey "uh-1h" gunship", MD 500E... just to name a few.


In FS9, once you start up the simulator.... go to SETTINGS, REALISM. set the top 4 sliders on your left to 1/2 way of REALISTIC. this will allow your Helos to be nice and calm throughout your flight from start to finish. once you get use to those settings, ease your way up the slider harder and harder..... this is about the only way that i can offer my suggestion...




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Post by mangaroca » Fri Dec 05, 2008 8:52 am

Hmm... :roll:

I guess I will fiddle with the air/cfg files a bit and see what can be done with yaw/pitch/roll stability...

Thanks for clearing this one out for me! :wink:

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hold on thar

Post by groundsquirrel » Fri Dec 05, 2008 11:20 am

It is true, you will need to reduce "realism" for best chopper experience in Fs9. Also, if you happen to pitch back more than 10 degrees Fs9 rotorcraft will also kinda lose control. Hitting the "slew" key and then releasing from slew will often regain control long enough for you to recover. Remember, more "realism" does not make FS more "real", it is simply the label the game designers applied to those particular game parameters. In this particular instance it takes less realism to become more real. Hmmmmmmmmm, almost sounds like........yes...yes....that's it! I have just arrived at a name for this circumstance...I shall call it Hollywood rules. Rule No. 1, it takes less realism to become more real.
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Post by Denholm » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:37 pm

I too experience the swinging of the helicopter in FS9. I just see it as a challenge and fly with the rudder pressed to one side.

GS, I don't think your new rule applies to planes as much as to copters. When near easy settings, my plane appears to have a stall limiter preventing it from making some nifty maneuvers. However, when on max realism that same plane can make some wicked moves. 8)
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Post by Cat1 » Fri Dec 05, 2008 8:37 pm

The biggest problem with helos in FS9 is that there is no true vertical thrust.
That's why you get airframe creep in a hover. A pilot would notice and null it out. You can't do that in the sim, as far as I am aware.
The dynamics that make the helo uncontrollable in backwards flight is stemmed from the same issue.
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Post by capt.PropwashKCHS » Fri Dec 05, 2008 8:40 pm

planes and helicopters are WAYYYYYY different. Planes dont have an extra engine on the tail trying to pull the tail sideways - helicopters have the vertical positioned rotor on the tail so that it can hover, but still turn 360 degrees, and to counteract the Torque that the main rotor is causing on the airframe.

(example= wet rainy day, take your v8 car out on the road. drive it nice and gentle. come to a dead stop and then gently push the gas from a stand still. car goes forward with LOTS of control. = airplane

now. stop again, and then just STOMP the gas... 1 tire spins faster than the other pulling the car to 1 side.. causing less control. The more the TORQUE on the frame, the more the frame wants to spin in a circle... turn the front wheels towards the direction the rear wants to go to keep your vehicle straight. = helicopter )

so. If you pull the REALISM sliders down to 1/2 way, the Helicopters will behave more appropriately like they should. HOWEVER!! in doing so, you will loose your "fly-by-wire" feel in your favorite Mach 2 bird. You will have to move the sliders back up for more control on your Planes.

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